Question:
Why do Germans call Dresden bombing war crime?
SSTT
2014-08-02 07:44:40 UTC
They were aiding Nazi war machine so Allies have done the right thing by blowing it up. As present Germans themselves are very much anti-Nazi so they mourn very much because of Dresden bombing?

Any one who helped Nazi war machine are all Nazis, and all of them need to be killed. So nothing wrong with Dresden bombing.
Sixteen answers:
?
2014-08-05 07:40:39 UTC
I see that Armourer has already used small bits of my Standard Dresden answer so I will post the whole thing here.

The biggest problem with dealing with the matter of the bombing of Germany is that it is judged against modern morals and standards of behaviour.



I am not in any way denying the fact that what happened in Dresden was horrific and appalling. I do deny that the men who undertook the mission have any crime to answer for.



The latest survey on how many died, done by a commission sponsored by the German Government found between 18 and 25,000 people died.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germ...



The bombing of an industrialised town from the air in an attempt to destroy its industry or cause such loss of morale amongst its inhabitants that they ceased to work was NOT a crime by the Rules of War in 1945. The bombing of Coventry, London and other British Cities in 1940 and 1941 was also NOT a War Crime.





In early 1945 the war was far from over. The Allies were still camped outside the borders of Germany, V2 rockets were still falling. The Allies had just fought the battle of the Bulge where the supposedly defeated Germans suddenly punched a huge hole in the Allied lines, German Rocket and Jet aircraft were coming off the production lines and proceeding to rip the hell out of the allied air fleets.

It was an operation undertaken due to many reasons.



1. A request from the Russians at the Yalta conference in February

1945. General Antonov "We want the Dresden railway junction bombed"

Meeting between the Chiefs of staff as reported by an interpreter. Records kept at the Public Records office in Kew



2. It was a German base of operations against Marshall Koniev`s left flank as he advanced into Germany. (See above)

Captured German High Command documents from Berlin in 1945 state that "Dresden is to be fortified as a military strong point, to be held at all costs." These statements are also backed up by decrypts from Ultra at Bletchley Park.



3. Munitions storage in the old Dresden Arsenal.



4. Troop reinforcement and transport centre shifting an average 28

troop trains through the marshaling yards every day. Intelligence from Russian and other sources stored in the Public Records office in Kew



5. Communications centre. Most of the telephone lines connecting

High Command to the Eastern front went through Dresden.



6. Quote from The Dresden Chamber of Commerce 1944. "The work rhythm of Dresden is determined by the needs of our army."



There were 127 factories in the Dresden Municipal area. The most

famous of these was Zeiss the celebrated camera and optics maker. In 1945 it was turning out Bomb aiming apparatus and Time fuses. (If you think the Dresden China Works making those lovely shepherdesses are more famous, they are actually made in Meisen 12Km down the River and always have been.)



A factory that previously made Typewriters and sewing machines was making Guns and ammunition



The Waffle and Marzipan machine manufacturer was producing torpedoes for the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe.



The arts and crafts workshops in the old town were using their woodworking skills to make the tail assemblies for V-1s.



Other factories were turning out such non warlike goods as Searchlights, Aircraft components, Field Telephones and 2 way radios.



"Anyone who knows Dresden only as a cultural city would be very surprised to be made aware of the extensive and versatile activity that make Dresden ONE OF THE FOREMOST INDUSTRIAL LOCATIONS OF THE REICH. (My Capitals)



Sir Arthur Harris? A Post war exponent of the bombing campaign?

Nope both wrong.

It comes from the Dresden City Council Yearbook of 1942.



The men who carried out these acts did so in the desire to make a world in which their descendants and countrymen, of whom I am one, could live in freedom from persecution and with a freedom to ask questions and form their own opinions. To those of you who feel it necessary to label them war criminals may I ask if you think that you could have asked a similar question under Nazi Germany or Imperial Japan?



Legally?

The "Rules of War" for WW2 were The Hague convention

(Laws and Customs of War on Land (Hague, IV), October 18, 1907) which was ratified by the U.S. Senate in 1908 was the international standard at the time of WW2.



These rules state. The officer in command of an attacking force must, before commencing a bombardment, except in cases of assault, do all in his power to warn the authorities.



This was done by the USAAF and RAF.Leaflets were dropped warning that any German cities were liable to be bombed during hostilities and telling the residents to leave.



It also states that "In sieges and bombardments all necessary steps must be taken to spare, as far as possible, buildings dedicated to religion, art, science, or charitable purposes, historic monuments, hospitals, and places where the sick and wounded are collected, provided that they are not being used at the time for military purposes.



It is the duty of the besieged to indicated the presence of such buildings or places by distinctive and visible signs, which shall be notified to the enemy beforehand.



The bombed cities of Germany all had industrial and military centres in them. Including Dresden. I do enjoy how people above stil spout the old lines of "Dresden was an open City" ( Complete BS. It had been designated as a military strongpoint) and "Dresden had no manufacturing" (Apart from the 127 factories making everything from bullets to tails for VI pilotless bombs to be fired indiscriminately at London and Antwerp)



Were the civilian and religous centres marked and told to the Allies beforehand? NO!!!.



So LEGALLY, the bombing was LEGAL by the "Rules of War" prevailing at the time.



Morally?

The worst thing you can do in war is fail to prosecute it to the fullest extent. Go after the enemy, harass them at every opportunity, kick them harder and harder until they give up. The Germans could have prevented the terrible losses they suffered from 1943 onwards by realising they were beaten and sending a message that they would give up. As they didn`t the Allies one aim was to beat them with the smallest loss of life on the Allied side. This is how you win a war. Anything else just causes more casualties in the long run



To give an analogy. if you found a man in your house about to rape your wife, would you smite him across the back of the head and say "excuse me old fellow, please go away"? NO!! What happens in that case is he truns round beats you senseless or kills you and still rapes your wife. If, However, you kick seven bells of S****e out of him until he wasn`t moving any more. Problem solved.





Ray
?
2016-06-02 21:23:38 UTC
1
busterwasmycat
2014-08-04 07:00:18 UTC
the firebombing of the city was simply murder of non-combatants, is the argument. there were industrial and military targets in the area of the city but those were not targeted by the bombing.



the basic issue is one of whether war is a game with rules or simply a horrible thing that has no rules and anything goes if it can or might end the war. It is more a question of where the line should be drawn rather than whether there are any lines that should not be crossed by man.



But really, in my view, the Germans cannot complain with any justification given the acts that they had already done (the blitz and the V1 and V2 were simply indiscriminate destruction, and that is really the argument concerning Dresden; not cool do perform indiscriminate destruction). They basically received what they had been dishing out.
2014-08-02 17:51:55 UTC
Lawyers of war argue that because there was no binding agreement defining the limits of air warfare during the conflict, bombing was not then a war crime – though, admittedly, this did not stop the Allies inventing retrospective laws to punish the German leaders at Nuremberg.



The former western Allies ought to look hard at their own record. They were just as capable as their enemies of engaging in ruthless destruction of the innocent.



The German population, just like the Japanese, must also be viewed as victims.
Chris H
2014-08-03 17:52:13 UTC
Because they can. Dresden was basically leveled. Factories, bridges, munition installations and other infrastructure would have sufficed. Allied forces took out hospitals, schools and housing projects. Dresden is eerie as there is nothing there that is old. The buildings have been reconstructed to appear "period", but they are all post-war recreations. I can't say that I agree with the tactics, but war is war (or it used to be).
Chetak.
2014-08-02 12:19:26 UTC
Bomber Command had seen the effect of fire bombing and had picked Dresden as a city as an ideal target to make it the biggest inferno possible.

There is debate if the German facilities in the city was warranted for the intensity of the raid, the Allies said yes.

It is an underlying fact that Allied Command wanted to send a clear message to the Soviets just how powerful fire bombing could do to their cities



It was not long later after the surrender of Germany that the Atomic bomb was exploded for the first time and the next two on Japan. Basically that negated the need for fire bombing on such a scale

Chetak
2014-08-02 23:48:16 UTC
Nazi Propaganda Goballs saw an Opportunity to discredit the Allies by claiming 500,000 dead when we all Know it was less than 25,000



this claim was made By the Dresden City council they buried them and recently added another 1500 to the List after they found more Bodies in a rebuilding Program to come up with approximately 25,000



There were 127 factories in Dresden Municipal most famous of these was Zeiss they made camera and optics In 1945 it was turning out Bomb aiming apparatus and Time fuses a Typewriter and sewing machine factory was making Guns and ammunition



another manufacturer was producing torpedoes for the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe.



the tail assemblies for V-1s. made in Dresden Other factories produced Searchlights, Aircraft components, Field Telephones and 2 way radios.



how do we Know it all comes from the Dresden City council 1942 year Book



I was Bombed for 5 years and had no problem with any of the Bombings after Fighter Command Bomber command was my second choice after WW2 and Bomber harris was my hero I served in the RAF for 9 year



thumbs down Must be My Girly troll
?
2014-08-02 23:03:13 UTC
Stalin asked the allies to bomb Dresden being a key rail center to slow the German troops retreating from the Russian front lines so they could not live to regroup and fight again at a greater advantage against the advancing Russians.
Juana
2014-08-02 13:44:43 UTC
It WAS a war crime because by February 1945 it was clear that Germany had already lost the war. Besides, the bombing of Dresden served no military purpose and was thus needless killing and destruction.



British military historian Alexander McKee wrote: "The standard whitewash gambit, both British and American, is to mention that Dresden contained targets X, Y and Z, and to let the innocent reader assume that these targets were attacked, whereas in fact the bombing plan totally omitted them and thus, except for one or two mere accidents, they escaped." He stated further: "The bomber commanders were not really interested in any purely military or economic targets, which was just as well, for they knew very little about Dresden; the RAF even lacked proper maps of the city. What they were looking for was a big built up area which they could burn, and that Dresden possessed in full measure."
?
2014-08-02 11:15:32 UTC
Off course, it was not a war crime since there was no international law that banned the bombing of civilians in World War II, yet the problem is from my research, Dresden was not a city that strategically aided the German war effort. That's why the firebombing of Dresden never achieved anything but destroying cultural targets and killing 25,000 civilian refugees for nothing. To pummel a city that had no strategic importance is highly despicable, not to mention waste of money and resources.
Mick W
2014-08-03 03:34:55 UTC
dresden was obliterated in 1000 bomber raids, as a direct reprisal for the germans attacks on coventry, which raised it to the ground,



Coventry Blitz - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coventry_Blitz Cached

The Coventry blitz (blitz: from the German word Blitzkrieg meaning "lightning war") was a series of bombing raids that took place on the English city of Coventry.

BBC ON THIS DAY | 15 | 1940: Germans bomb Coventry to destruction

news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/november/15/... Cached

The German Luftwaffe has bombed Coventry in a massive raid which lasted more than 10 hours and left much of the city devastated. Relays of enemy aircraft dropped ...



Bombing of Dresden in World War II - Wikipedia, the free ...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Dresden_in_World_War_II Cached

The Bombing of Dresden was an attack on the city of Dresden, the capital of the German state of Saxony, that took place in the final months of the Second World War in ...

Bombing of Dresden - Spartacus Educational

spartacus-educational.com › … › Air War

Bombing of Dresden; The Second World War > ... After the Second World War Air Marshall Arthur Harris came under attack for the bombing raid on Dresden.

Bombing Raids On Dresden - Image Results

Photo: Dresden air raid victims being cremated 500 at a time on the ...

Air raids: Dresden can be seen in flames following allied bombings in ...

... body of a woman in the air-raid shelter – Dresden, February 1945

The Fire Bombing of Dresden, Germany!

... photos as evidence of the results of the bombing raid on Dresden

Dresden Bombing Photos

Dresden after the bombing raid.

... Dresden World War II Air Raids: German Report: 25 000 Died in Dresden

More Bombing Raids On Dresden images

BBC ON THIS DAY | 14 | 1945: Thousands of bombs destroy Dresden

news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/february/14/... Cached

Dresden is regarded by the Allies as the centre of its rail network linking eastern and southern ... The Dresden raid raised moral concerns about the bombing campaign.
tuffy
2014-08-02 11:37:42 UTC
There are those who question whether Dresden was a military target. However, destroying a city can also destroy the morale for a country to countinue fighting.
exactduke
2014-08-02 11:06:20 UTC
The Japanese, and the Germans (to a lessor extent) tend to think of themselves as victim's. Poor little olde us, what have we done to deserve this.

Tens of thousands of German troops passed thru Dresden on the way to the Russian front. Bombing it was bound to hurt that movement & destroy transportation - rail & roadway's, etc.



Once you let loose the 'dogs of war', bad things tend to happen.
2014-08-02 13:38:01 UTC
http://justice4germans.com/warcrimes/
robert43041
2014-08-02 08:20:39 UTC
Except that it was "overkill".
2014-08-09 04:57:11 UTC
very good question.....


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